-- Start log: Wednesday, May 23, 2001 9:34:43 pm ASI Meeting Server time --

Severy has arrived.
dcarson says, "helo"
Severy says, "Howdy!"
dcarson says, "OK Scotyy whats the news?" Scottyg says, "Ok, there's an
email on the way. The subject is our non-profit application." Scottyg says,
"I have received a letter from the IRS requesting additional information."
Scottyg says, "Much of what they are asking are about things we haven't
formally decided yet, so I don't know how to answer them." Scottyg says,
"And we have a June 6 response date." Severy says, "Scotty, resend the
message without "help" in the subject, Majordomo bounced it because of
that" Scottyg says, "Ack. Ok."
Scottyg says, "Ok, its on the way again." Severy says, "After we're done
discussing that stuff, I'd like to revisit the Moon Society home page
redesign, a new WSD feature changes the options for that significantly..."
Scottyg says, "Ok. I have a couple of other items too. Not as important as
#1." dcarson says, "got it"
Scottyg says, "Nothing is going right tonight. Now I can't seem to check
mail. Have any of you received the 2nd message?" Scottyg says, "GMTA!"
Scottyg says, "I'll be back in a minute while ya'll read the attachment."
Scottyg says, "Ok, back now."
Scottyg says, "That letter came to me via snail mail, so I had to scan it,
ocr, and then fix the mess that ocr always makes. That's why I'm late."
dcarson says, "the publication part we might need to talk to Peter Kokh
about" Scottyg says, "In the original application, I tried to answer the
questions about activities in a general way. They obviously want MUCH more
detail, and we haven't made those decisions yet." dcarson says, "501C3
status is very useful, they don'y give it out easily" dcarson says,
"worldcons which have all the details already known take a year or more to
get it" Scottyg says, "A few of the items are just boilerplate stuff. Such
as the Articles of incorporation. As I recall, I printed a copy and sent
it. Looks like they want a copy of the State letter granting the charter
plus a certified copy." Severy says, "Sheesh, they want a lot of details!"
irs arrives.
dcarson says, "2,and 3 are easy"
dcarson says, "Hi Ian"
irs says, "Hi Guys."
dcarson says, "4 we need to write something up" Scottyg says, "Yep Randall.
More than I feel like I can supply without some guidance from the Board."
dcarson says, "5 we need to thinkabout what we should spend money on"
dcarson says, "6 I think we more or less know but we need to write it up in
detail" Scottyg says, "Ian, your email should have a message from me.
You'll need to get that to understand this meeting." dcarson says, "7 we
need to decide and write up" irs says, "It'll take me about 8 minutes to
log off from this account, get that message, and get back. Should I?"
dcarson says, "8 should be fairly easy" dcarson says, "9 we need to talk to
Peter probably" Scottyg says, "I think you should Ian." irs says, "Be back
soon."
irs has disconnected.
dcarson says, "10 sort of goes with 5 " dcarson says, "does that match your
thinking?" Scottyg says, "Yep. I can handle #2, #3, #4, and #8." Scottyg
says, "The others are beyond my individual authority to address." The
housekeeper arrives to cart irs off to bed. dcarson says, "are we going to
go for 501c3 for ASI?" Scottyg says, "Yes."
Scottyg says, "I think I can explain away why we haven't done it yet."
dcarson says, "ok so that clears the biggest question on 4" dcarson says,
"we need to get Rhoda to help on some of this, I think shes done this for
other orgs" dcarson says, "5 and 10 we need to decide what sort of things
we want to sponser that are directly related to the moon" dcarson says,
"the award we are palnning would be one of those" Scottyg says, "She
replied to my email, so I replied back asking her to join us." irs arrives.
dcarson says, "rehi Ian"
irs says, "rehi. Got the letter. Reading it now." Scottyg says, "WB Ian."
Scottyg says, "Ian, I can handle #2, 3, 4, and 8." Scottyg says, "The rest
involve matters that the Board hasn't decided yet, so I need help with
those." dcarson says, "(I assume the last one should be 10 and not 5
again)" Scottyg says, "The IRS always manages to irritate me. They think
its perfectly ok for it to take two months for them to get around to
processing it, but we're required to respond in two weeks." Scottyg says,
"Dana, the last one?"
irs says, "OK, I've read it."
irs says, "Re: time. That's the government for you. Same deal with the PTO,
and I assume most other agencies." dcarson says, "the numbering seems to go
1-9 and than 5 again" Scottyg says, "Ummm...My copy doesn't show that." irs
says, "If you're asking me for the answers, I can give a few, but first, a
question: HAVE we determined exactly what the Moon Society will be doing,
and why those activities should be tax-exempt?" irs says, "Other than that
we want people to give us donations, and don't want to pay a lot of taxes,
of course." Scottyg says, "The last three lines are numbered 10, a, and b."
dcarson says, "we can always respond with something and than when thy sedn
a letter saying not enugh detail on numbers N send a finished one" irs
says, "Scotty, he means the last question on page 3." Scottyg says, "Yeah,
my copy has the bottom of that page showing 10. Please address.....research
activities." Scottyg says, "And subparagraphs a & b below that." dcarson
says, "yep, looks like a 5 on mine" dcarson says, "not a problem"
irs says, "No biggie."
Scottyg says, "Hmmm. I did it as four separate pages, then copied & pasted
them all into one document. Looks like something happened there. (My
printed copies were from the 4 separate page version." Scottyg says,
"Ian...The letter was sent to me via snail mail. I had to scan it and run
OCR to get it in email form." dcarson says, "I don't think any ocr errors
matter, lets worry about the content" dcarson says, "sorry"
irs says, "So, back to my question. Have we determined what the
organization's activities will be that would make it a tax-exempt endeavor?
Remember, I'm asking because I'd been absent for a few months there, and
I'm not really sure what I missed." Scottyg says, "No we haven't Ian. Thats
why I'm asking for help. I can't make those decisions alone." dcarson says,
"not in the sort of detail this needs, unless has stuff he hasn't discussed
with us" dcarson says, "add a Greg in that last line" Scottyg says, "BTW.
The original filing is only available in paper form, so I'll have to mail a
copy to anyone who needs it." irs says, "OK, then if we want to complete
this application (and having started it, I think we'd better do our best to
finish it), we're going to have to come up with something. May I suggest:"
irs says, "The organization has not yet started operations. Its aim is to
serve as a means of communication and gathering among members who are
interested in furthering the goals of lunar development. Toward that end,
the organization will be encouraging research into all fields of endeavor
necessary to enabling people to develop the moon. The organization will
make the results of its research and discussion available to the public, as
an outgrowth of the Artemis Data Book, currently available at
http://www.asi.org/adb. <more>" irs says, "The organization will also
engage in efforts to educate the general public about lunar development,
and to promote it as a desirable goal." irs says, "A question: do we want
to claim that we'll be engaging in political lobbying? For the IRS, this is
the biggie: lobbying organizations have far more exacting requirements and
limitations. If we set ourselves up to NOT be a lobbying organization, any
such lobbying loses us our tax-exampt status, and threatens us legally.
However, it makes like much easier to set it up and maintain tax-exempt
status." dcarson says, "( we cosponsered last years Lunar Development conf,
that should go somewhere)" irs says, "A lesser question: do we plan to give
grants for research?" irs says, "Yes, Dana, that's one thing to use as an
answer to question 1." dcarson says, "I think we should give grants when we
ever get enough of a income to afford to" Scottyg says, "No, we explicitly
DO NOT engage in lobbying." irs says, "I think so, too, but a grant means
the money is gone. And for a non-profit to give away money, there are
limitations (f'rinstance, we can't give money to a for-profit). On the
other hand, we can fund research under our own aegis, if we then own the
results, any resultant patents, and so on." Scottyg says, "I just sent a
copy of the page where I described the activities on the original
application." irs says, "That's fine, Scotty. It should make our life much
easier. However, it may be at odds with what some members think/assume
we've formed the Moon Society for. We will have to make it clear that
legally, the Moon Society cannot do so. Individuals may; the organization
may not." irs says, "Can you send a copy to ian@lrcpubs.com? I have to log
off this account to get to my main e-mail address (though I'm planning to
modify that soon)." Scottyg says, "Ian...See the Articles of Incorporation.
Lobbying is expressly prohibited." Scottyg says, "Ok, will send."
irs says, "Fine. I'd forgotten. No problem. Just trying to cover a lot of
the questions that came up when I was doing stuff like this in Mensa."
dcarson says, "thet may have a different idea of grassroots than you meant
Scotty" irs says, "As long as we're agreed, explaining legal regs to the
members can come later. Right now, we have to deal with this form." Scottyg
says, "Yeah Dana. I think "grassroots" pushed a button." dcarson says, "we
need to explain that its doing talks about space to groups not organizing a
letter campaign to congress" Scottyg says, "Uh-huh. Non-political
grassroots." irs says, "Still haven't received it here." irs says, "Talking
about space to public groups is precisely the form of public
outreach/education that the IRS wants to see for an application like this."
Scottyg says, "Its still sending. (I'm on a modem tonight.)" Michael
arrives.
irs says, "Ah, OK."
Michael goes home.
irs says, "If they want proof of those talks, I can send a list of my
activities (except they've all said Artemis Project, not Moon Society, but
it may be a start)." dcarson says, "we've siad we'll provide kits with
viewgraphs etc to members, so we can list that as a thing we do" irs says,
"While I'm waiting, let me skip a bit. Number 6: how about "We anticipate
setting up local chapters that will be subsections of the organization; not
separately organized." I say that, because some of Mensa's local chapters
are separately incorporated, and, except for the super groups (with
thousands of members, and more money), that separate incorporation is more
of a pain in the ass than useful." Scottyg says, "Ian, I sort of agree, but
a decision was made to do it the other way." Scottyg says, "Ok, I think the
mail should be arriving at your end by now." irs says, "Number 7: yep; the
word 'grassroots' is a buzzword that sets up warning flares. What you said
above: that grassroots meant talks to other groups and local education
programs. The organization does not intend to engage in political
lobbying." irs says, "Re #6: If we're wedded to doing local groups the
other way, the best answer would be: 'We anticipate setting up local
chapters that will, when appropriate, seek to separately incorporate and
file for Employer Identification Numbers. At the moment, no such chapters
exist.'" irs says, "For #8, how about: 'The Artemis Society International,
as a service of the for-profit Lunar Resources Company, was found to be too
limited in scope to satisfy the desires of its members. Negotiation with
the Lunar Resources Company led to the decision to form a new, more
autonomous organization -- the Moon Society -- to encompass the members'
desires for what the organization should be, and to enable it to operate
separately from the Lunar Resources Company.'?" irs says, "Oops. Sorry. You
said you already had #8." irs says, "Regarding our publishing activities
(#9): The organization expects to publish a newsletter for the members that
will not be sold publicly, but will be funded through membership dues. The
organization also expects to continue and expand the publication of the
Artemis Data Book on-line. The Artemis Data Book is, and will remain, a
free publication, available to all on the web. Copyright for the content of
the ADB resides jointly with the author of the individual piece and the
Moon Society." Scottyg says, "I think it will take a little more detail
than that, but what you siad is the gist of it." Scottyg says, "(On # 8)"
Scottyg says, "The hard ones are #5, 9, & 10" Scottyg says, "I discussed
the newsletter a little in the original app. No mention of the ADB."
Scottyg says, "I suppose I could send the entire application. Its abot 15
pages, much like the one I just sent. There were also attachments that are
available on-line." irs says, "I don't think I need them all. Gimme a
minute: computer is slow." Scottyg says, "They are moderately large files.
The form is a background image, with overlaid text." Scottyg says, "Oops,
there is a continuation of the page 2 info. I need to send page 2A" irs
says, "Can you just give me our "exempt purpose" in a line or two?" Scottyg
says, "See
http://www.moonsociety.org/organizing-documents/articles-of-incorporation.html"
Scottyg says, "Article III"
Scottyg says, "Also Article IV re lobbying." Severy says, "I'm afraid that
I'm going to have to head off to bed..." Severy says, "Scotty, your latest
message to the board list bounced because it was too long (due to the big
attachment)" Severy says, "I'll stay logged in here so I can catch up
tomorrow morning on anything else that was discussed..." Scottyg says,
"Hmmm. Page 2A should be smaller than Page 2. Did anyone get Page 2?"
dcarson says, "as a new mail after the first doc?" dcarson says, "no"
Scottyg says, "I sent three docs total....IRSletter.doc, 1023Page2.doc, and
1023Page2aTextOnly.doc" dcarson says, "got the first one at the start of
this haven't seen the others" Scottyg says, "The attachments were 22,528,
222,208, and 35,840 bytes long respectively." Scottyg says, "Ok, I'll send
the other two directly. severy@cyberteams,com and dcarson@toad.net ?"
dcarson says, "yep"
Scottyg says, "Ian, how about your copies?" dcarson says, "don't forget
Rhoda"
Scottyg says, "Ok, I'll add Rhoda."
Scottyg says, "Ian...Do I need to resend to you?" Scottyg says, "Ok, you're
getting them whether you need them or not." Scottyg says, "Ok, that mail
should have arrived by now." dcarson says, "got them, had to restart eudora
it hung in the middle but looks OK now" Scottyg says, "It took a long time
for them to send." dcarson says, "I don't think we can do this all tonight"
dcarson says, "Scotty can you send the bits we've written up tonight to the
bod list and we'll see if we can come up with a final version?" Scottyg
says, "Nope. All I hoped to accomplish tonight was to have a plan." Scottyg
says, "Yep, I'll copy & paste it." dcarson says, "eudora keeps locking up
on me tonigt, think after we're done I'll reboot" dcarson says, "what else
do we need tonight?" dcarson says, "Arthur Smith pointed out that Friday is
the 40th anniv of Kennedy's moon speech" Scottyg says, "I think thats all
for tonight Dana." dcarson says, "OK"
Scottyg says, "Ok, meeting transcript sent." dcarson says, "thanks"
Scottyg says, "I have a problem doing that. Netscape doesn't seem to
recognize the same clipboard as TkMOO" Scottyg says, "So I have to
copy-paste into a text editor, save the file, and open a new Netscape
window on that file. Then I can copy from that window into the composer
(Mail) window." Scottyg says, "()*(*&*&%^%*$@*@$%^^*(**)( computers!"
Scottyg says, "(Running on Linux)"
Scottyg says, "Well, its bedtime."
Scottyg says, "G'nite!"
dcarson says, "so did you finially send it OK, if not I can" Scottyg says,
"Yep, its sent. You should have it." dcarson says, "like I siad I need to
reboot and see what eudorsa problem is" dcarson says, "gnight"
Scottyg says, "Darn. Wonder if that bounced too?" Scottyg says, "I don't
have my copy...." Scottyg says, "Oh. Here it is now."
Scottyg says, "Ok, it went out ok."
Scottyg says, "G'nite!"
Scottyg has disconnected.
The housekeeper arrives to cart Scottyg off to bed. dcarson goes home.
irs has disconnected.
The housekeeper arrives to cart irs off to bed. dcarson arrives.

-- End log: Thursday, May 24, 2001 12:45:04 am ASI Meeting Server time --