-- Start log: Wednesday, June 20, 2001 10:44:58 pm ASI Meeting Server time-- 

irs says, "Hey, look at me! I didn't have to at-join (I just followed
you)!" Scottyg says, "That works too. Just remember that you will keep
following until you turn it off." Greg arrives amidst thundering applause.
irs says, "Didn't use anything. I typed "north" and then wandered in."
Scottyg says, "Or did you mean you duplicated my moves?" irs says, "Yeah,
that one."
Scottyg says, "Ok. You can also say "follow scottyg" and anywhere I go,
you'll tag along." Greg says, "Everybody page Randall. Maybe we can get his
attention if is computer makes lots of noise." irs says, "Hmmm. Neat."
Greg says, "As soon as we are in order I'm going to do this: I move that
the Moon Society board of directors adopt the following resolution: The
Moon Society shall immediately remove from its web pages any reference to
receiving tax-deductible donations and shall refrain from soliciting
tax-deductible donations in any publications until the Society has received
exception by the IRS under section 501(c)(3)." dcarson says, "second"
irs says, "And I will immediately second the motion." Scottyg says,
"Whenever we are in order....." Severy has arrived.
Greg says, "Ah, here comes Randall."
Severy says, "Someone rang?"
Severy grins.
irs says, "Everyone rang, except me."
irs says, "I couldn't figure out how."
Greg says, "We need to pass a board resolution, Randall, and you're
chairman of the board, so gravel us to order." Greg says, "Is the recorder
on?"
irs says, "Saw it go on when I came in." Scottyg says, "You say: page
Severy with "message"" Greg says, "How do you tell if the recorder is on?"
Scottyg says, "look recorder"
Greg says, "That got me a description." Greg says, "Oh, I see, there's a *
in the "Recording" button." Scottyg says, "Also, just look tells you about
the room objects." Greg says, "Randall, the whole board is here so you can
call us to order at any time." Severy says, "I hereby call this meeting to
order!" Greg says, "Thanks! I waive notice of this ad hoc meeting of the
Moon Society Board of Directors." dcarson says, "i waive notice"
Greg says, "(We gotta do that again for the recorder.)" irs says, "I waive
notice of this ad hoc meeting of the Moon Society Board of Directors."
Scottyg says, "For the record, the time is 22:50 hours, june 20, 2001"
Severy says, "I waive notice of this ad hoc meeting of the Moon Society
Board of Directors" Scottyg says, "I also waive notice of the Board of
Directors meeting." irs says, "Scotty moved to EDT?"
Greg says, "OK, are we all in order now?" Greg says, "I move that the Moon
Society board of directors adopt the following resolution: The Moon Society
shall immediately remove from its web pages any reference to receiving
tax-deductible donations and shall refrain from soliciting tax-deductible
donations in any publications until the Society has received exception by
the IRS under section 501(c)(3)." Scottyg says, "22:50 hours EDT."
Scottyg says, "I second the motion."
Severy says, "All in favor?"
Greg says, "Aye."
Severy says, "Aye"
Scottyg says, "Aye"
irs says, "Aye."
Severy says, "Dana?"
Scottyg says, "Also for the record, the only known location of such a
record is at http://www.moonsociety.org/register/register.php3" Greg says,
"And I cannot find that document in WebSite Director." Scottyg says,
"Excuse me...."
Scottyg says, "Also for the record, the only known location of such a
record is at https://www.moonsociety.org/register/register.php3" dcarson
says, "aye"
Severy says, "<slam> The motion passes!" Greg says, "Also for the record,
/register/member-form.html has a place to add a donation but does not claim
that such a donation would be tax-exempt." dcarson says, "who edits the
page?"
Greg says, "Anybody who can find it!"
Scottyg says, "Me."
Greg says, "How could the server be serving a file that doesn't show up in
WSD?" Scottyg says, "I've already been doing some work on it because of the
new dues structure." Scottyg says, "Greg, its in the secure server.
Different WSD." Greg says, "Oh."
Greg says, "No wonder I couldn't find it!" irs says, "Scotty, it also
offers a $90 membership in the 2001 Moon Society conference. If we're not
hosting one, we can't try selling memberships in it." Greg says, "I'm still
hoping we can have a conference later this year." Severy is going to be
away from the keyboard for a while irs says, "Even so, Greg, it's bad form.
Especially now that the IRS is scrutinizing us." Scottyg says, "
https://www.moonsociety.org/cgi-bin/wsd/wsd" Scottyg says, "Yep Ian. The
whole page needs to be redone to remove that, change the dues choices, and
present a more friendly interface. It was my top priority until the IRS
letter." Greg says, "Is there a parallel secure-server WSD for ASI?"
Scottyg says, "Nope. ASI doesn't have a secure server." Greg says, "ASI has
the Thawte license, but the Moon Society has the secure server?" Scottyg
says, "(ASI doesn't have an SSL certificate)" Scottyg says, "ASI owns the
moonsociety.org URL." Greg says, "I'm just trying to figure out who's
what." Greg says, "Aha! That explains it!"
Scottyg says, "We should clean that up, but we don't need to complicate
things even more right now." Scottyg says, "Back to the questions in the
letter....I'm also a little concerned about #4." Scottyg says, "I "winged"
a similiar question on the annual return (Form 990), and will probably just
duplicate what I said there, but they may want a more detailed response."
Scottyg says, "Ok, here's the plan of action:" irs says, "The problem
addressed in number 4 is the IRS doesn't want a tax-exempt taking
tax-exempt donations, and then turning around and giving them to a taxable,
to avoid paying tax. They're very careful about that sort of thing. Perhaps
"we won't give grants, but may fund work under our own auspices"?" Scottyg
says, "1. I will call the IRS contact person for an explanation of #6d, and
I will also ask for additional time to respond, explaining i was out of
town when the letter arrived." irs says, "Sorry I interrupted."
Scottyg says, "S'ok. Goes with the territory." Scottyg says, "2. I will
write up something on each question, probably by Friday evening, and email
it to the board list. I would like to have any suggestions back by Saturday
evening or early Sunday morning." dcarson says, "ok"
Scottyg says, "3. I'll write the final draft on Sunday and send it to the
board list Sunday evening. If i hear no objections by Monday morning, off
it goes." Scottyg says, "Any objections?"
Greg says, "Sounds like the best plan we could have at this point!" irs
says, "sounds ok to me."
Greg says, "If they really need a detailed program plan for #1, that's
going to take us quite a while longer." Scottyg says, "On #2, the
resolution must be signed and dated by two officers, so i guess someone
needs to send me a signed copy. That may hold things up a little." Greg
says, "Are you going to type it up on whatever letter you're using,
Scotty?" Greg says, "They want two officers to sign it, but since we just
passed that resolution as the Board of Directors, we should probably sign
it as board members." Scottyg says, "I can do that, but you may not get it
soon enough to get it in tomorrow's mail." irs says, "Don't do that, Greg.
They're very precise in what they want and don't. If they want two
officers, we need to give them two officers. Scotty, ask if the second
officer can print out a copy and sign it and overnight it in, when you call
(two copies, two signatures)." Greg says, "Yeah, and mail from here seems
to be very slow." Scottyg says, "It will read like: "We the undersigned
hereby certify that the following resolution was adopted by the Board of
Directors at a duly convened meeting on June 20, 2001. etc." Greg says,
"Officers aren't empowered to make policy decisions." Greg says, "On the
other hand, if Scotty and I both sign it, we can sign it as both officers
and board members." Greg says, "Scotty, I wonder if it would help to show
the IRS the actual proposal we submitted to NASA for the Steckler Lab. If
that's not 501(c)(3) research, then I don't know what is." Scottyg says,
"Greg, the only problem is...."we" didn't submit it." Scottyg says, "The
Moon Society has to stand on its own merits, and it didn't participate in
the proposal." Greg says, "No, but we did say we were going to donate to it
if the research grant is approved by NASA." irs says, "They're quite
explicit about donations. A 501(c)(3) registered entity can only give money
to another 501(c)(3) entity (to the point that the bylaws must include a
provision that, upon dissolution, all assets will be transferred to another
501(c)(3))." Greg says, "On the other hand, the guy at UNR screwed it up
it's hard to tell exactly what we're proposing to do." Scottyg says,
"That's correct Ian. But a 501c3 can fund research conducted by an
individual or a for-profit so long as proper controls are maintained.
That's not a "donation"" Scottyg says, "There's a pretty extensive section
in the 990 instructions covering a lot of that." Scottyg says, "Let me try
to paste what I said on the 990 into here....." Greg says, "I've lost track
-- do I have any immediate action items?" Scottyg says, "The following
tests are applied to determine that individuals or organizations receiving
grants or loans from the Society in furtherance of its charitable programs
qualify to receive payments:" Scottyg says, "1The grant or loan must
support education, research, or legal activities related to exploration and
settlement of the Moon, outer space, and other celestial bodies, or must be
made to another 501c3 organization." Scottyg says, "2The grant or loan must
be a reasonable or customary amount in relation to the activity conducted."
Scottyg says, "The grant or loan must not be an Excess Benefit Transaction
as defined by section 4958 and proposed amendments." Greg says, "That
sounds reasonable to me." Greg says, "Geez ... I have to reboot again.
Nothing on my machine is working. BRB." Greg has disconnected.
Scottyg says, "I made up those rules ad-hoc to satisfy what I judged to be
required by the rules." Scottyg says, "So that's where I will start for
question 4." Scottyg says, "But I don't think that fully addresses the
"control and discretion" part of the question." Scottyg says, "That would
involve such things as frequent progress reports and reviews of
expenditures, with provision to terminate if funds are not being properly
used." The housekeeper arrives to cart Greg off to bed. Greg arrives amidst
thundering applause. Scottyg says, "Welcome back!"
Greg says, "Back again!"
Scottyg says, "I'll replay a few comments I made while you were away...."
Greg says, "OK"
Scottyg says, "Let me try to paste what I said on the 990 into here....."
Scottyg says, "The following tests are applied to determine that
individuals or organizations receiving grants or loans from the Society in
furtherance of its charitable programs qualify to receive payments:"
Scottyg says, "1The grant or loan must support education, research, or
legal activities related to exploration and settlement of the Moon, outer
space, and other celestial bodies, or must be made to another 501c3
organization." Scottyg says, "2The grant or loan must be a reasonable or
customary amount in relation to the activity conducted." Scottyg says, "The
grant or loan must not be an Excess Benefit Transaction as defined by
section 4958 and proposed amendments." Greg says, "I think I've learned the
hard way not to install software while I'm running a dozen different
applications." Scottyg says, "I made up those rules ad-hoc to satisfy what
I judged to be required by the rules." Scottyg says, "So that's where I
will start for question 4." Greg says, "Scotty, yeah, I remember that
part." Scottyg says, "But I don't think that fully addresses the "control
and discretion" part of the question." Scottyg says, "That would involve
such things as frequent progress reports and reviews of expenditures, with
provision to terminate if funds are not being properly used." Greg says,
"Question 1 sounds like the scariest part. They really do need a detailed
program plan." Scottyg says, "Or possibly an arrangement in which payment
is made upon submission of documentation of work satisfactorily performed."
Greg says, "Yeah; progress reports before payments are made. Audits of
expenditures." Greg says, "In other words, we only make progress payments."
Scottyg says, "Yeah, #1 is the hardest. I think a place to start is with
what I said on the original application, and expand from there." Greg says,
"Yes."
Greg says, "separate description of each activity"" Greg says, "Gollly."
Greg says, "I wonder if they could provide us with examples of what they're
looking for." Greg says, "Or maybe someone else could." Scottyg says, "I
thought I had done that the first time around, but they obviously want much
more complete descriptions." Greg says, "Yup. "When and where each activity
will be conducted."" Greg says, "Who conducts it."
Greg says, "and the amount of time spent on each activity? golly!" Greg
says, "We don't have any kind of detail for that. We don't even know what
the opportunities are." Scottyg says, "I'll try to get something circulated
ASAP with those original descriptions." Greg says, "But I would think that
these answers should only pertain to people who are being paid to do these
things." Scottyg has disconnected.
Scottyg says, "I'll try to get something circulated ASAP with those
original descriptions." Scottyg has connected.
Greg says, "Are you back, Scotty?"
Scottyg says, "Yep"
Greg says, "Aside: I still need Windows users to test this URL:
http://moonsims.asi.org/skins/f/tourguide/pasiphae.zip" Scottyg says, "I'll
try to get something circulated ASAP with those original descriptions."
Greg says, "I *think* the current version is good." Greg says, "Yeah, that
will help."
Greg says, "But it sounds like we really do need to write a bunch of
research proposals to ourselves so we can show the IRS what we want to do.
Maybe we should guesstimate the amount of time spent on each activity, and
then guesstimate what percentage of that will be paid labor." Greg says, "I
think our key criterion is that none of these activities is intended to
make a profit, and all of them involve scientific research or education."
Greg says, "Oh, BTW, while your back was turned we started another
education project that we'll have some support for Space Grant: An
educational program cast as a contest for K-12 kids to design a flag for
the moon." Greg says, "(I keep forgetting you don't read artemis-list.)"
Greg says, "See http://www.moonsociety.org/flag/" Greg says, "National
Space Grant Foundation and Iowa Space Grant Consortium have committed to
help us get the word out." Greg says, "We will need to raise funds to pay
for transportation for the grand prize winner and parents." Greg says,
"Iowa Space Grant will offer an additional state-wide prize." Scottyg says,
"transportation to...?"
Greg says, "Nevada Space Grant K-12 coordinator will help us get in touch
with K-12 teaching consortia WORLD WIDE!" Greg says, "Transportation to the
next annual Moon Society Conference to receive the grand prize, which is a
life membership in the Moon Society." Scottyg says, "Your latest zip looks
good here Greg." Greg says, "We also might have the flag sewn up (by
Melva?) and presented to the winner." Greg says, "Hooray!"
Greg says, "Did all the BMP files work?" Greg says, "No .bin files in
there?"
Greg says, "There should be 1 JPG, and the rest are text or BMP." Scottyg
says, "All the extensions look reasonable. i haven't yet opened the files."
Greg says, "it's a start!"
Scottyg says, "I have 6 .bmp, 1 .jpg, 1 .txt, and 2 .skn files" Scottyg
says, "Oops, add one more .bmp and 2 .cmx to the above." Greg says, "That's
good. The .cmx and .skn files should be plain text. They're Sims files. CMX
defines the character. SKN is a 3D mesh." Greg says, "So I think the Moon
Flag Contest would be a good addition to the Moon Society's educational gig
for IRS purposes." Greg says, "Back to the IRS questions: Do I have any
action items that aren't triggered by receiving something from Scotty?"
dcarson says, "not that I know of"
Greg says, "Oh good. I wanted to make sure I didn't overlook something."
Scottyg says, "Ummm, no. I'll send the resolution. You'll need to print,
sign, and return it to me. And then review what I send around for answers
to questions." Greg says, "Hey Dana, could try downloading
http://moonsims.asi.org/skins/f/tourguide/pasiphae.zip to your Mac to see
if it works?" Scottyg says, "Hmmm. Windows paint complained about
HRL01gt_tourguide.bmp. Says it isn't valid bmp format." dcarson says,
"looks like it worked"
Greg says, "Hmmm ... I wonder if this Sims gig would count as an
educational acitivity. Obviously my goal is to bait in Sims users, but I
also want to show people what it will be like to live in the moon and get
them thinking about it." Greg says, "Oops! There should not be a 1 in the
filename for HRL01gt_tourguide.bmp" Scottyg says, "It shows an image which
is just a white rectangle." Scottyg says, "Is it HRL0lgt_tourguide.bmp?"
Greg says, "How about HFLOlgt_tourguide.bmp ?" Greg says, "Yeah, it's a
lowercase L."
Greg says, "In simspeak, lgt is "light", as in "light-skinned"." Scottyg
says, "There's an HRL and an HFL" Scottyg says, "The HFL opened ok."
Greg says, "Yup, that file is corrupted in my download, too." Greg says,
"Damn!"
Greg says, "Oops! No wonder! The original file is corrupted!" Scottyg says,
"All the rest of the bmp's and the jpg opened ok." irs says, "Am I required
for anything else tonight? Gotta get up in the morning for the day job."
Greg says, "Hit da sack, ian."
irs says, "Oh, and was anyone interested in splitting my room in Las Vegas
for the Lunar Development Conference?" irs says, "Thanks, Greg."
irs says, "e-mail if you want the bed (across the Strip from Caesars, save
about $100 for the four nights)." irs has disconnected.
Greg says, "OK, I'm going for another test on that zip file." Scottyg says,
"Well, I think its time for me to go too. If I get to bed reasonably early,
I can get some of this done before work tomorrow." Greg says, "Yup, me too.
Have a good one!" Scottyg says, "G'nite!"
Greg disappears, leaving but a wistful memory that lingers in your mind.
Scottyg has disconnected.
The housekeeper arrives to cart irs off to bed. The housekeeper arrives to
cart Scottyg off to bed. In a blinding flash of light, Severy vanishes into
thin air

-- End log: Thursday, June 21, 2001 6:21:56 am ASI Meeting Server time --