-- Start log: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 9:22:13 pm ASI Meeting Server time --

Greg-2 says, "So now the offical December 15, 2004 meeting of the Moon
Society Leadership Council shall commence." kokhmmm says, "Greg, as senior
Board member, do you want to grab the gavel until Randall returns/" Greg-2
says, "Sure, Peter."
Greg-2 says, "Let's follow the agenda that Peter sent to the Leaders list."
Greg-2 says, "First up is the membership processing report." Nancy-1 says,
"There were 3 renews and 1 new subscription. :)" Greg-2 says, "Hooray!
Thanks, Nancy!"
kokhmmm says, "Thanks, Nancy"
Greg-2 says, "Anything else on the membership report?" kokhmmm says, "Next.
Paper renewal notices. " Greg-2 says, "Right."
MikeD says, "what's the total membership now?" MikeD says, "current
membership that is" kokhmmm says, "I have the letter composed, the list of
addresses for those expiring, the envelopes (outer and return) and stamps.
I'll start tomorrow." Greg-2 says, "I see 174 current members reported by
Team Director." kokhmmm says, "Mike, you have to do a report. I get a
report automatically on the 25th of the month from WSD" Greg-2 says,
"Sounds great, Peter!"
kokhmmm says, "I will be scheduling a letter sending session once a month."
Greg-2 says, "Yeah. Just go to
http://www.moonsociety.org/cgi-bin/teamdir/teamdir and click on the Reports
button. There's a "Statistics" report all set up." Greg-2 says, "Item 2 on
the agenda is a dicussion of the proposed mission and vision statements."
Greg-2 says, "Are we referring to the ones that Gary Gray sent?" MikeD
says, "I think so"
kokhmmm says, "MMM is now getting address corrections from the Post Office,
and I will be correcting the listing in Team director accordingly."
garygray says, "I guess that'smine.!"
garygray says, "The general purpose is to have some focus on what we do and
a quick hook to new people!" Greg-2 says, "Gary, what was the date of your
message about mission and vision statements?" kokhmmm says, "Yes, right
now, one has to think to look up the bylaws, and perchance find Article II
Objectives" garygray says, "About a week ago?!"
Greg-2 says, "(I"m trying to find it in the archives of the Leaders list.)"
kokhmmm says, "Greg, I think the email was entitled recommendations" MikeD
says, "I think it was sent on the 7th" garygray says, "Greg, It might be
invisable!" Greg-2 says, "Ah here we go: 12/7/2004. Message subject "Re:
[LEADERS] Some recommendations"" MikeD says, "no, before that"
MikeD says, "maybe that is it"
MikeD says, "why can't we have these meetings at 2 am PST?" Greg-2 says, "I
think that despite the "Re" in the subject, this is the start of the
threads." john-r says, "Mike - because the sun is too bright??" garygray
says, "What I;m looking for are comments.suggestions from people!" Greg-2
says, "I have an idea... I'll put this on a web page so folks don't have to
search their email archives. Justasec..." kokhmmm says, "Steve pointed out
some grammatical corrections needed" garygray says, "I can re0send it in
the next day or two.!" john-r says, "Gary - how were SJ's comments take?"
john-r says, "taken"
Greg-2 says, "I'm sure we can find nits to pick but this is great stuff. It
gives us a focus." garygray says, "Steve made sime important comments that
might or will change my recommnedations!" kokhmmm says, "Some of the points
got sarcastic, but we tried to take the positive and constructive elements
and use them." garygray says, " I am looking for other people's comments.!"
Greg-2 says, "Hmm... I don't see much sarcasm in Steve's comments, Peter."
garygray says, "But not really tonignt during the meeting!" MikeD says,
"I'd say that mainly you should rewrite the parts with buzzwords as they
are best avoided at all costs" john-r says, "my felling is that the mission
should be short - to a few items that we may do with in a year and a couple
of long range - " kokhmmm says, "Steve pointed out, and this is good, that
the language is too succinct. I think it has to be, and that we need to
append a link to a "fuller explanation."" garygray says, "Buzzwords are
good, they buzz along very well!" MikeD says, "buzzwords are 80s"
kokhmmm says, "Gary is putting up an amended version. I think we should all
look at it and send feedback so that an improved version can be discussed
at the Jan 5 meeting." MikeD says, "like making quote signs with your
fingers" john-r says, "so for now we can continue on the list and go to the
next agenda item?" Greg-2 says, "I agree that mission statements and vision
statements should be concise. They can be supported by an elaborate white
paper." kokhmmm says, "80's or not, it still goes on everywhere." MikeD
says, "yeah, but it's cliche"
kokhmmm says, "Then, I think that sounds like a gameplan." MikeD says, "I
have no argument with the general content" kokhmmm says, "Mike, we just
need new buzzwords, then its so 00s" garygray says, "Greg, perhaps several
white papers over time!" kokhmmm says, "Yes, both these statements and a
backup paper, will essentially always be works in process" Greg-2 says,
"It's not elegant, but look here:
http://www.moonsociety.org/private/leaders/mission_statement_notes.html"
Greg-2 says, "I just picked the template named leadersbiz.main and got
whatever I got. :)" garygray says, "Okay I look at it!"
MikeD says, "why's it green?"
Greg-2 says, "Mike, see above. :)"
Greg-2 says, "That file has Gary's note plus Steve's reply. Some of the
long lines need word-wrapping, though. Darn." kokhmmm says, "I did reply to
Steve's remarks. I think most of them were helpful. Gary, do you have my
reply also?" garygray says, "yes, Peter!"
kokhmmm says, "I am willing to work with Gary, running thoughts back and
forth, to produce an improved document before next meeting" garygray says,
"I would hope that approved vision and mission statement would be put on
iur web site!" kokhmmm says, "I really want to thank Gary for taking this
initiative; indeed for noticing the hole in our public presentation! "
john-r says, "i can put it on our web site - but not iur site" john-r says,
"what peter said"
Greg-2 says, "Yeah, what Peter said."
garygray says, "And if everyone could spend some time to think on what to
enclude, all the more better!" kokhmmm says, "John, yes once it is improved
to everyone's satsfaction." john-r says, "understood"
Greg-2 says, "Peter, it actually would be easier to review if it were a
document on the web to start with. Erm... I think." garygray says, "Let's
go on with the agenda, Greg!" kokhmmm says, "We could put the finished
statements (or links to them) on the /about/ page" kokhmmm says, "Item 3"
MikeD says, "Gary do you have access to the page Greg put your stuff on?"
garygray says, "No, I don't think so!"
Greg-2 says, "I used the Leaders private area." kokhmmm says, "I can show
Gary how to access that (just learned how myself)" Greg-2 says, "If you're
on the Leaders time you should have access." kokhmmm says, "I'll work with
gary on that" Greg-2 says, "http://www.moonsociety.org/private/leaders/"
Greg-2 says, "That has links to WSD Express and everything else." MikeD
says, "and if you have Internet Explored on a PC you can use the online
WYSIWYG editor" Greg-2 says, "OK, thanks, Peter."
Greg-2 says, "Mike, don't encourage a sinner to sin. :)(" garygray says, "I
work with Peter!"
Greg-2 says, ":), too"
Greg-2 says, "Item 3 on the agenda is about the list of Volunteer
Positions" kokhmmm says, "We talked about this last year" kokhmmm says, "We
discussed art with Ian and Chip" Michael arrives.
Greg-2 says, "So the idea here is to have a position like "Art Director" or
"Art Maven" or "Image Maven" or somesuch." Michael says, "hi folks!!!"
kokhmmm says, "The need remains. Should we advertise for someone to take
charge of finding and soliciting artwork?" Greg-2 says, "Maybe "Official
Pixel Scrounger"" kokhmmm says, "Michael, read tonights agenda fromt he
emaail I sent" Greg-2 says, "My thinking is that it's a really good idea."
garygray says, "Hi, Michael!"
john-r says, "Hi Michael"
kokhmmm says, "Greg, the need is clear, and what we need is clear. But what
do we call the job, seriously?" SJ has arrived.
SJ says, "Greetings."
Greg-2 says, "Magazines have Art Directors." SJ has agenda printout. Yea.
kokhmmm says, "Greetings, Steve"
Greg-2 says, "So maybe an organization can have an Art Director, too?"
garygray says, "Hi Steve!"
john-r says, "Hi Steve"
Greg-2 says, "Hi Steve! We're down to item 3 on the agenda that Peter
mailed out." SJ nods. My input: "Of course."
kokhmmm says, "We need to get Ian involved in the job description. Maybe he
would also have the right name for the position. " Greg-2 says, "For item
2, Gary and Peter are working on an update the Vision Statement and Mission
Statment. I put the original note plus your review of it here:
http://www.moonsociety.org/private/leaders/mission_statement_notes.html" SJ
says, "NB - art director is not the same talent as artist; many artists are
terrible art directors." Greg-2 says, "Steve, yeah. The real position is
'Official Scounger Of and Beggar For Artwork That The Moon Society Can Use
Without Worry'" MikeD says, "so what do we actually need?" kokhmmm says,
"Steve, our problem has been that our best artwork is owned by Vik Olliver
and he wants to be paid everytime we use it." SJ says, "Many artists will
show yo their art portfolio as proof they can art direct. Irrelevant. "
kokhmmm says, "We need artwork, new artwork, to which we have rights. " SJ
is in full sympathy with artists who like to be paid, but yes, what you
just said. MikeD says, "so what we need is artists" kokhmmm says, "We were
talking with Ian and Chip about that last year." kokhmmm says, "Artists who
will grant us wide rights of use." MikeD says, "and then you need someone
to act as art director to filter out all the dross before it comes to us
for approval" SJ says, "So you want somebody who can tell good art from
drek and who can say persuasively "This is a donation." Drek won't help
us." kokhmmm says, "Many artists will do work for free *if* it is widely
disseminated and makes them well known and brings in business for fees."
kokhmmm says, "That's it Steve. We want to ask for someone like this on our
Volunteer page. What would you name this position?" Michael-1 arrives.
Michael-1 says, "doh"
Michael-1 says, "silly wireless"
kokhmmm says, "doh to you too,Michael!" SJ says, "Art Director! "
kokhmmm says, "Never tried it"
Michael-1 says, "my favorite stock photo archive: sxc.hu" Michael-1 says,
"all cost and royalty free" kokhmmm says, "Guess that's as good as any. The
Job description will clarify what's involved." SJ has a Situation here and,
having just arrived, will have to go away for 45 mins to an hour. Thanks to
the magic of An Agenda (yea) I can leave input. 4: Sure, why not, some
people will really like it, but don't expect it to be any more efficient
than these meetings are. It's a stunt. 5: Not clear on the issue - are we
talking about individual solicitations, or an announcement? 6a: Sounds
reasonable. 6b: Yes. 6c: Yes. kokhmmm says, "What's the full URL, Michael?"
Michael-1 says, "http://sxc.hu/"
SJ apologizes for post-and-run! I'll try to return before you leave. SJ has
disconnected.
Greg-2 says, "Wow! So... we'll call this position Art Director and Peter is
responsible for beating the bushes to flush out a victim." Greg-2 says,
"Any more on that?"
kokhmmm says, "on 5, Steve. I just haven't gotten around to it. I'll dig in
on Friday." Greg-2 says, "Heh. If we keep with the agenda in order we'll
get through it all. :)" kokhmmm says, "Greg, okay, but after running the
job description by Ian." Greg-2 says, "Sure thing, Peter."
Greg-2 says, "On to item 4, the Town Hall Meeting?" Severy-6 is finally off
the phone with his girlfriend Greg-2 says, "Are you thinking of doing in
the MOO? Perhaps in the Auditorium?" kokhmmm says, "Yes, I'd like a swift
running meeting so we can get to the jam session free for all before quit
time." MikeD says, "TownHall meeting?"
Greg-2 says, "Randall, thank her on our behalf. :)" kokhmmm says, "Yes,
Greg, that was my thought." Michael has disconnected.
Severy-6 says, "Sorry for being mostly AWOL the past month, folks, I was
out of town for most of the past two weeks and I'm still trying to catch up
from that" Greg-2 says, "I think it would work out nicely if we publicize
the bejesus out of it." kokhmmm says, "Building on Arthur's ideas for guest
speakers. Thought we could rotate town meetings and speakers" kokhmmm says,
"Yes, we'd have to have a couple of months head start" Greg-2 says,
"Randall, I'm just waiting for you to break your leg on one of these ski
trips so that we can more attention from you. :)" kokhmmm says, "I need to
familiarize myself with all the auditorium features" MikeD says, "Wouldn't
we be better to use some sort of IM server that most people can figure out,
the MOO scares off the younger ones" kokhmmm says, "We need to advertise by
email to members, on the website, in MMM" Greg-2 says, "Yeah."
Greg-2 says, "I'm not scared of no MOO." The housekeeper arrives to cart SJ
off to bed. Greg-2 says, "Part of the campaign could be "Meet Us In The
MOO"" MikeD says, "wont work"
Greg-2 says, "Have we tried it?"
MikeD says, "look how few of out members have come to the MOO in all these
years" kokhmmm says, "My thought was to post a few URLs for people to
prepare. I'd give some remarks, then open up the floor. Something like
that" garygray says, "Or maybe Meet us on the Moo*n(!" Greg-2 says, "The
Town Hall Meeting could be bait, with a note that if folks woudl like to
practice in the MOO they're welcome to stop by any time." MikeD says,
"Randall, does the jabber server support meeting rooms?" kokhmmm says,
"But, Mike, its worth a try AFTER advertising the bejeezus out of it, like
Greg says. If it flops it flops" dcarson says, "customize the web interface
so we have a page that drops them right into the meeting, no navigation
needed" MikeD says, "or can we get some sort of Yahoo, AIM or MSN server?"
Greg-2 says, "Good idea, Dana. Can we do dat?" Michael-1 says, "livemeeting
possibly?" kokhmmm says, "That would certainly boost attendance, Dana!"
Severy-6 says, "Jabber supports multi-party conferencing, but only with
Jabber clients" Greg-2 says, "We could just meet in The Commons." MikeD
says, "Could we interface the MOO with FlashChat?" Greg-2 says,
"Gentlemen... there is nothing wrong with the MOO. :)" The housekeeper
arrives to cart Michael off to bed. MikeD says, "there is nothing wrong
with it apart from the fact that it's flipping boring as all heck"
Michael-1 says, "excetp unfamiliarty on teh part of the target audience."
MikeD says, "and what Michael said"
Michael-1 says, "#1 lesson I learned from teh dot com bubble: don't try and
sell a product that requires the customer to change their behavior before
they buy." Greg-2 says, "I don't think it's a good idea to get bogged down
in talking about other meeting environments because anything we choose will
present the same problems. Some people will have the clients and accounts
and some won't." Greg-2 says, "But with the MOO, everybody has access and
the web client makes it universally accessible." Severy-6 says, "You can
set up a web page with a built-in MOO client that takes people to the right
place" MikeD says, "that might help"
MikeD says, "can the buffer be made more user friendly for them?" Severy-6
says, "Buffer?"
Greg-2 says, "Randall, about the word "You" in that statement... :) :) :)"
Greg-2 says, "Which "You" did you mean?" MikeD says, "the existing java web
client only retains about 100 lines of text" kokhmmm says, "Greg sweats
bullets waiting for response" Greg-2 says, "Peter, I'm not sweating this
one. I don't know how to do it. :)" Severy-6 says, "Non-hardcore MOO users
don't need more than 100 lines of buffer" MikeD says, "I would say they
need a bit more, like maybe 500 lines" Severy-6 says, "Why?"
Michael-1 says, "many people can't handle the pace of chat...." MikeD says,
"Because I've been there done that and not been able to find someones
answer to my question when I got called away" john-r says, "i agree with
randall on lines saved - how many are as nutty as this bunch? (i have 2
megs in mo logs saved and then lost on disk crashes" Severy-6 says, "If
you're in a conference call on the phone and get called away, what
happens?" Severy-6 says, "Or in a lecture?"
kokhmmm says, "John, do you back up on CDs, DVDs, or drives?" Michael-1
says, "but this is supposed to be better than those...." MikeD says, "John,
Randall is correct that they don't need a big buffer, but I think it should
be more than it is" Severy-6 says, "If you get called away, you get called
away, we don't have to try to compensate for every possible circumstance"
kokhmmm says, "We need a way for attendees to request a log of the meeting"
Severy-6 says, "If they want to multitask, they can get a real MOO client
that has a larger buffer" john-r says, "on back ups , on prior machines, my
2.6 disk was broke, and no cd-rw - i now have cd-rw and do backups" kokhmmm
says, "Has anyone used the auditorium before? and its features?" Greg-2
says, "Yeah, I agree with Randall. I don't see that the MOO is broke."
MikeD says, "I never said the MOO was broke" Greg-2 says, "What I meant was
that I don't see anything that needs to be fixed." Severy-6 says, "Yes,
Peter, we've used the auditorium several times for presentations" Greg-2
says, "I'm thinking that hard-core users will get a client." MikeD says, "I
just want to make it easier for the members to come in and chat" Greg-2
says, "A prettier client would be nice, but I don't know of one." Greg-2
says, "Prettier web client, that is." kokhmmm says, "All the present
clients are neuter. What do you expect?" kokhmmm says, "Okay, I'll put
together a more complete proposal for next meeting. " kokhmmm says, "We can
skip item 5. I'll just dig in." kokhmmm says, "So we could go to 6. a"
Greg-2 says, "What? We need sexier clients?" kokhmmm says, "Sexier,
prettier? Just working the words" Greg-2 says, "Well, you said 'neuter'.
:)" john-r says, "i need to sleep a cold off - ck your e-mail - Its been a
rousing meeting so far" john-r says, "night"
john-r has disconnected.
Greg-2 says, "Item 5 on the agenda is about speakers." Greg-2 says, "What
are you looking for there, Peter?" kokhmmm says, "We can skip that. But
anyone who has suggestions for speakers for ISDC please email them, with
contact info, to me. Thanks" Greg-2 says, "OK"
kokhmmm says, "I'll try to start on this Friday." Greg-2 says, "Item 6 is 3
things for the Board of Directors." Greg-2 says, "Do we have a quorum?"
kokhmmm says, "That's all on 5."
Greg-2 says, "Steve has already provided his input so I think we can count
him as present and voting." kokhmmm says, "John just left. "
Greg-2 says, "Rats."
kokhmmm says, "That was clearly Steve's intent." Greg-2 says, "Let's see...
we have Dana, Randall, Michael, and me." Greg-2 says, "And Steve."
kokhmmm says, "Greg, Dana, Randall, Steve, Michael" Greg-2 says, "That's 5
of 7, right?"
kokhmmm says, "Yup!"
kokhmmm says, "Thio 7 of 9 ..."
Greg-2 says, "So, Oh Great Chairman of the Board, might we request an
official Board meeting?" Greg-2 says, "(Was that a Star Trek joke?)"
kokhmmm says, "Uh huh"
Greg-2 says, "I've never seen that series but I think I recognize the
reference to the gal in the skintight jumpsuit." kokhmmm says, "But then, 7
0f 9 was no joke!" Greg-2 says, "Oh... Rannnndallll.... ?" The housekeeper
arrives to cart john-r off to bed. kokhmmm says, "You'll have to get the
DVD when it comes out" Severy-6 says, "Sorry, I was in another window"
Greg-2 says, "Can we do a Board meeting. :)" Severy-6 says, "Sure!"
Michael-1 says, "aye!"
Greg-2 says, "LOL"
dcarson says, "waive notice"
Michael-1 says, "are we voting yet?"
Severy-6 pounds a large gavel on the floor (he couldn't find the desk)
Greg-2 says, "Indeed, I also waive notice" Severy-6 says, "Does everyone
waive notice of this meeting?" Severy-6 waives notice
Michael-1 says, "yes"
MikeD says, "yes"
kokhmmm says, "Steve waived notice and voted" Michael-1 waives notice
Greg-2 says, "I'd say that we can take it that Steve Jackson waived notice
by postin his votes." Severy-6 says, "I hereby call to order an officious,
er, official meeting of the Moon Society Board of Directors" Michael-1
says, "aye!"
MikeD says, "the bylaws specifically state that you cannot vote in
absentia" Severy-6 says, "All board members present please identify
themselves" Severy-6 is here
MikeD says, "here"
Greg-2 says, "here"
Michael-1 says, "here"
Greg-2 says, "Mike, that's a good point." Greg-2 says, "A noisome point,
but a good one." kokhmmm says, "So Steve's vote counts as a recommendation"
MikeD says, "it also makes proxy voting a non starter" dcarson says, "here"
Severy-6 says, "Peter, are you here? :-)" kokhmmm says, "Still have 5 0f 7"
MikeD says, "he's not on the board"
kokhmmm says, "I'm here but cant vote"
Severy-6 says, "Oops, that's right"
Greg-2 says, "Who are the 5?"
MikeD says, "me"
Severy-6 says, "Shows how much I remember :-)" kokhmmm says, "Greg, Mike,
Michael, Dana, Randall" Greg-2 says, "I do that all the time, Randall."
Michael-1 says, "aye!"
MikeD says, "what are we voting on?"
Greg-2 says, "LOL"
Severy-6 says, "Ok, a quorum being present, what business do we have before
the board tonight?" kokhmmm says, "Item 1 is possible ammendment (added
language) of Bylaws Article VII, Section 1" kokhmmm says, "(the Chairman of
the Board chairs the meetings) add language guiding the" kokhmmm says,
"passing of the gavel when the Chairman is not present by 15 minutes after
the" kokhmmm says, "advertising opening of the meeting)" Severy-6 notes
that Michael has his automatic Aye trigger turned on :-) Greg-2 says, "The
first is a proposed amendment to the bylaws, Article VII, Section 1."
Severy-6 says, "I presume that language applies to meetings of the Board?"
Michael-1 says, "2nded"
Greg-2 says, "I move that we amend the bylaws to include: "In the absence
of the chairman of the board, the board of directors shall elect a chairman
pro tem from among the board members who are present."" kokhmmm says,
"Randall, the language we have says that you chair the meeting as Chairman
of the Board." Greg-2 says, "(That's probably already covered by Robert's
Rules but we might as well be explicit.)" kokhmmm says, "In your absence we
stumble about. The new language would give guidance as to who gets the
gavel." Severy-6 says, "Correct, Peter, but note that the regular Wednesday
meetings are not normally actual board meetings" MikeD says, "It was
mentioned to me recently that we should specify *which*version_ of Roberts
Rules" Severy-6 says, "I have typically had the gavel historically in my
role as Chairman of the Leadership Council, *not* as Chairman of the Board"
Greg-2 says, "Mike, yes we should. But that's a different topic." kokhmmm
says, "The gavel would go to the senior board member present at a quarter
after the hour, senior being determined by lowest membershipnumber." MikeD
says, "just mentioned it as it re-occurred to me" kokhmmm says, "Well if it
is a board meeting or not, we do need some set procedure." Michael-1 is
crashing hard so let;s vote quick... Greg-2 [to reiterate:]: I move that we
amend the bylaws to include: "In the absence of the chairman of the board,
the board of directors shall elect a chairman pro tem from among the board
members who are present." MikeD says, "seconded"
Severy-6 says, "All in favor?"
Greg-2 says, "(Note that my motion varies from Peter's.)" MikeD says, "aye"
Michael-1 says, "2nded"
Greg-2 says, "aye"
Severy-6 says, "Aye"
kokhmmm says, "Greg, wouldn't that take aboard meeting to elect someone?"
Michael-1 says, "aye!"
Severy-6 says, "The motion passes"
kokhmmm says, "And how does that differ from what we do now?" MikeD says,
"that ammendment only applies to the board meeting" Severy-6 says, "But
note that the regular Wednesday meetings can be led by anyone, the bylaws
do not apply to the Leadership Council" MikeD says, "what we generally do
does *not* apply to a board meeting" Greg-2 says, "Peter, I'm thinking that
if the board members who are present can't figure out how to elect a
chairman pro tem for that one meeting, they probably don't have any
business trying to hold a meeting. :)" Greg-2 says, "Randall, agreed."
kokhmmm says, "Okay, got it Randall. Ok, Greg" kokhmmm says, "On to b."
Greg-2 says, "6a and 6b: I move that the board approve the list of advisors
and proposed advisors that Peter provided on 12/15/2004, with our
enthusiastic support and commendation." dcarson says, "second"
Greg-2 says, "Make that b and c. Oops." Severy-6 says, "All in favor?"
dcarson says, "aye"
Greg-2 says, "aye"
Severy-6 says, "Aye"
Michael-1 says, "aye"
Severy-6 says, "The motion passes"
MikeD says, "aye"
Michael-1 thinks we should do "arghh!" instead so we can make our meeting
sound like a tavern full of pirates... kokhmmm says, "Thanks, everyone, The
letters will go out in a couple of days." Severy-6 laughs.
Greg-2 says, "Administrivia: Who is going to update the Bylaws? Or do we
need to do something more formal before it's official?" Severy-6 says, "Any
other business to come before the board tonight?" Greg-2 says, "I don't
remember the exact language of how to amend the Bylaws." Michael-1 says,
"hmm... talk like a pirate day should be coming up soon." kokhmmm says, "I
can do that, Greg."
Greg-2 says, "Arrrrr"
kokhmmm says, "By the way, Randall, can you mail out the log for tonight
and for two weeks ago?" Greg-2 says, "Let's check to make sure we don't
need to revist that Bylaws change." MikeD says, "Peter, the bylaws page is
controlled by a template" Michael-1 says, "nope....sept 19th"
kokhmmm says, "Okay, then you get to do it Mike!" MikeD says, "can't, can't
publish"
Severy-6 says, "Will do, Peter"
MikeD says, "Isn't that the secretary's job?" Greg-2 says, "Article XI -
Amendments says..." Greg-2 says, "Section 1. Amendment Procedure: The
Bylaws may be amended or repealed only by the following procedures which
require a two-thirds vote of the Board of Directors or a majority vote of
the Board of Directors followed by a majority vote of the eligible members
of the Society who vote. Notice, including the exact wording of any Bylaws
amendment to be considered, shall be sent in writing to the members of the
Board of Directors not less than forty (40) nor more than sixty (60) days
prior to any meeting at which such a Bylaws amendment is to be considered
and voted on by the Board of Directors. Mail votes on amendments shall be
conducted in accordance with the document "Rules for Mail Votes". A member
shall be eligible to vote on the proposed amendment only if continuously a
member during the entire month of the date of mailing of the issue of the
Society publication or mail communication used to present the amendment to
the members for purposes of a vote." Greg-2 says, "Did we get a 2/3rds vote
of the board on that?" Greg-2 says, "Does waiving notice of the meeting
count as waiving the 40-to-60-day requirement?" kokhmmm says, "Can you be
author and me publisher?" MikeD says, "if we got 5 votes we did"
kokhmmm says, "5 of 7 is more than 2/3" kokhmmm says, "I think"
Michael-1 says, "but 7 of 9 is more than a handful" MikeD says, "what Greg
just posted however, would seem to indicate a membership vote may be
required" Greg-2 says, "Yes, 5/7 = 71%"
Greg-2 says, "7 of 9 is more than a 10" kokhmmm says, "Aaargh!"
Greg-2 says, "Mike, there's an option for the membership to override a
deadlock in the board." MikeD says, "oh, 2/3 or a majority plus a
membership majority" Greg-2 says, "Aye, matey."
Greg-2 says, "Mike, right."
Greg-2 says, "So the only question is the waiving of notice." Greg-2 says,
"But heck, if 2/3rds of the board waive notice and vote in favor, with no
objects, it's OBVIOUS that the motion would pass in 40 days." Greg-2 says,
"So my thinking is that yes, we're legal." MikeD says, "sounds like it to
me"
Greg-2 says, "If we were within 40 days of an election where a new board
might be coming in, I'd be more cautious about it. But we're not, so I
think the time period is moot." kokhmmm says, "Anyway, we just elaborated
the provision, rather than altering it." Greg-2 says, "That too, Peter."
MikeD says, "Peter, we've never really had much of a problem with board
meetings, it's the leadership council meetings that are a disorganized
mess" Greg-2 says, "I suspect that if there were a proposal that were so
controversial that the 40-days notice were important, then it would not be
possible to get a 2/3rds majority of the board to agree to waive notice."
kokhmmm says, "So who changes the bylaws on tghe web?" Greg-2 says, "Erm...
I think Dana took care of it the last time we did this." MikeD says, "I
would have thought that was the job of the secretary" dcarson says, "ok,
I'll update them later tonight" Michael-1 has to head to bed now.... just
can't stay awake.... Greg-2 says, "It's kind of a question of webcraft at
this point, I think." kokhmmm says, "It's not a change in the bylaws we are
talking about, Mike, but the web record." Greg-2 says, "Have a good
evening, Michael!" Michael-1 says, "cya!"
Michael-1 has disconnected.
The housekeeper arrives to remove Michael-1. MikeD says, "Article V,
Section 2 still needs to be updated" Greg-2 says, "All that said, I have no
more business for the board tonight, and have no objection to adjourning
the board meeting. :)" kokhmmm says, "Dana said he will do it, Mike" MikeD
says, "ok"
kokhmmm says, "Party, Party, Party!"
MikeD says, "I second that"
Greg-2 says, "(That was kind of a hint for Randall.)" Greg-2 says, "And
while we wait for Randall to gavel the board meeting closed..." Severy-6
says, "I move that we adjourn this meeting" Greg-2 says, "Item 7 is Pter's
New Business and Open Discussion." kokhmmm says, "Anyone have anything else
or new?" Greg-2 says, "I'll second that, Randall!" Severy-6 says, "All in
favor?"
Greg-2 says, "aye"
Severy-6 says, "Aye"
dcarson says, "aye"
MikeD says, "aye"
kokhmmm says, "Mike?"
Severy-6 says, "Thwack!"
Greg-2 says, "(You can usually get away with adjourning a meeting "without
objection". That takes care of the situation where most of the guys have
already left.)" Greg-2 says, "Ouch!"
Greg-2 says, "That's what I get for trying to steal your cupcake." Severy-6
says, "I hereby declare this meeting dead, er, over!" Greg-2 says, "Made a
mess of the cupcake, though." kokhmmm says, "Did you catch the note that I
added Grant Proposal Writer to the list of Volunteer Positions needed
list?" kokhmmm says, "Along with Translators, as previously discussed"
MikeD says, "I caught that alright"
kokhmmm says, "On the Town Meeting idea, obviously there is no ideal day of
the week, no ideal hour. That said, are there any suggestions?" MikeD says,
"Greg, could you disconnect me from that keep alive script before you
retire for the night?" kokhmmm says, "Is that an electronic intravenous
feed, Mike?" MikeD says, "I'm afraid on the town meeting idea, the most
useful time is about the same time we have these meetings" kokhmmm says, "I
see that the BAMS people are still trying to get together for a meeting."
MikeD says, "Peter, I've been suffering from MOO timeouts a lot recently,
Greg tried connecting my MOO object to a 'keep aliv' script that he has,
but it's not helping" kokhmmm says, "And Margo is trying to stir up trouble
in the mid-Atlantic" kokhmmm says, "I see, Mike"
kokhmmm says, "It's been a good meeting, thanks everyone!" Greg-2 says,
"Mike sure"
MikeD says, "Peter, the BAMS peoole could do with putting something up to
date on their website" garygray says, "Peter. I think Mike is right about
the time for the TownHall meeting!" MikeD says, "I'm sure Tim knows how to
do that, as does Rhoda" kokhmmm says, "I'm going to retire. Let the
housekeeper know." kokhmmm says, "What di Mike say about the Time for the
Town Hall Meeting?" MikeD says, "I said about the same time we have these
meetings" kokhmmm says, "That's what I was thinking too, Mike." garygray
says, "The same time as the Leadership meetings!" MikeD says, "that way you
catch the most people from North America where 90% of our members are"
MikeD says, "you might consider 10 Eastern instead of 9 though" Greg-2
says, "OK, Mike, you should stop receiving Keepalive() now" kokhmmm says,
"But we could cycle the timing from one meeting to the other, to benefit
ET-CTers one time, and MT-PTers next time." MikeD says, "Thank's Greg"
MikeD says, "not alone did it not help, I couldn't figure out how to send
the output to /dev-null" garygray says, "Goodnight, everyone!"
Greg-2 says, "If you're using MUSHClient you do it with a filter." kokhmmm
says, "Goodnight, gary"
garygray has disconnected.
MikeD says, "I couldn't find the filters Greg" Greg-2 says, "By un-checking
the box where it says "Send to world'" kokhmmm has disconnected.
Greg-2 says, "It's under Game... Configure... Filters" MikeD says, "ah"
MikeD says, "no, hang on"
Greg-2 says, "Oops!"
Greg-2 says, "NO... Game... Configure... Triggers" Greg-2 says, "That is
'Triggers', not 'Filters'" MikeD says, "that's what I thought"
MikeD says, "ok, so it was the send to world thing that got me" MikeD says,
"What I've done is setup an automatic reconnect" Greg-2 says, "There are
boxes where you can check "Omit from Output" and "Omit from Log File""
Greg-2 says, "I had it backwards."
MikeD says, "I saw those, but they didn't help" Greg-2 says, "For example,
you would have set up a trigger on Keepalive* with those settings." Greg-2
says, "Yeah. Darn."
Greg-2 says, "It looks like you'll have to go back to pull instead of
push." MikeD says, "I'll figure something out, this problem has gradually
gotten worse in the last year" MikeD says, "First when I got DSL, then when
I upgraded my OSes, then when I got WiFi" Greg-2 says, "It could be that
you're getting an actual interruption of service from somewhere between the
server and your machine." Greg-2 says, "Rather than a simple timeout." The
housekeeper arrives to cart garygray off to bed. The housekeeper arrives to
cart kokhmmm off to bed. MikeD says, "I'm going to try something that Dave
suggested, but first I have to purchase parts to get my Linux box going
again, I also have to purchase parts so I can give my 10 year old the
computer she's getting for christmas" Greg-2 says, "Scotty had that
problem. It was wind blowing his antenna around." Greg-2 says, "He uses a
microwave link for net connection." MikeD says, "I could be getting an
interruption of service in any of the DSL modem, router or the OS" MikeD
says, "I don't think the wind is effecting my connection at present" MikeD
says, "not unless the telephone cable from the street is airborn, which I
think it's not"

-- End log: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 11:06:10 pm ASI Meeting Server time --