-- Start log: Wednesday, March 6, 2013 9:28:36 pm ASI Meeting Server time-- 
Lunadyne says, "Howdy everyone and welcome to the March 6th Moon Society
Leadership meeting." Strangelv-2 checks the time. it's 20:29 Lunadyne says,
"First up: Membership report. Membership is holding steady from the last
meeting at 170." Lunadyne says, "Any questions on membership?" Lunadyne
says, "Seeing none, let's move on to the Treasurers' Report. Dana did you
see my e-mail about the reimbursement check?" PhilipC has arrived. PhilipC
says, "hi everyone" Lunadyne says, "Evening Philip!" Strangelv-2 says, "I
believ we now have quorum" dcarson says, "yes, I think he easiest is you
send a check for the other half back" Lunadyne says, "Will do. Where do we
stand with the books?" Strangelv-2 still doesn't see his email with the
minutes on Leaders list pjbanyai has arrived. Lunadyne says, "James, got it
direct." dcarson says, "going over the books I am missing bank statements
for 11/05 to 4/06" PhilipC says, "Dana, did you give the treasurer report
yet?" dcarson says, "I hadn't noticied because they are the earliest of the
ones I had to enter" Strangelv-2 says, "I didn't get it to everyone direct,
though" dcarson says, "Scotty had sent then to me when I first started so
they are around here, am looking through my files to see where I misfiled
them" Lunadyne says, "But are we good from like 2007-2012? Frankly I think
we only need the last three years audited." dcarson says, "everything else
is done" dcarson says, "yes good every when else" PhilipC says, "I only ask
because it looks like we're in the middle of it. I'm just wondering what
the basics are. How much do we have in the bank, how much came in, and how
much came out" Lunadyne says, "I propose that we then move to the audit
phase for that, where we retain a CPA and have them render an opinion on
the last three years." dcarson says, "OK" Strangelv-2 says, "Are we ready
for a montion on that?" Lunadyne says, "It seems that the easiest would be
for you to find someone local. The books shouldn't be that big a deal. Only
we're in the middle of tax season." Lunadyne says, "James, we've already
got approval and a budget of $500 for services." Strangelv-2 says, "So no
motion needed. Okay." AlanSteinberg says, "might be worth waiting until the
summer just due to the season and all" Lunadyne says, "Hopefully it will
cost nowhere near that much." Lunadyne says, "Aren't the CPAs still waiting
on the final tax forms?" dcarson says, "will call around" Lunadyne says,
"Excellent. If we get Phil's questions answered we can close out the
Treasurers' report." dcarson says, "as of end of Jan, $31,407.11 in the
bank" PhilipC says, "playback recorder" PhilipC says, "play back recorder"
dcarson says, "plat # on recorder" dcarson says, "play" PhilipC says, "play
recorder" Scottyg-1 says, "Try play recorder" PhilipC says, "i did!"
Strangelv-2 suspects this may not be a good idea in the middle of a meeting
one needs to be attending pjbanyai says, ""play current on recorder""
Strangelv-2 says, "Unless this one behaves a lot differentyl than the one
in NSS MOO" PhilipC says, "good, i didn't miss much. any way" Lunadyne
says, "No, we chatted for a bit waiting for folks to show up." Lunadyne
says, "Plus, I had some Java issues and was late as well." Lunadyne says,
"Any other questions on the Treasury? Having audited books is a big step,
and should put us right with Paypal." Lunadyne says, "Seeing none, let's
move on to the website, which we were chatting about right before we
started the recorder." Lunadyne says, "The specific page in question is:
http://moonsociety.lunarpedia.org/201303web/Template_Mockup_N306_2327.png"
PhilipC says, "The main point I want to make with treasury is that I'd like
to see actual reports of where we are financially. how much money we have
in the bank, how much is coming in, and going out. if possible how we're
doing compared to last year. " PhilipC says, "But moving on" Strangelv-2
notes that the minutes have finalyl made it through the milter filter
PhilipC says, "This is the first time I'm seeing this background."
Strangelv-2 says, "This variant was created earlier today" Scottyg-1 says,
"And Philip, you may have overlooked that http://test.moonsociety.orh is
online and running Drupal." Lunadyne says, "Philip, there's really not a
lot of Treasury activity other than routine admin stuff and mail expense
for MMM. Dana did reimburse me for the underwriting of the Lunar Sample
Bags at last year's Moon Day, a net of $178." Lunadyne says, "something I'd
like to see included in our Ye Olde Moon Shoppe -
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/moon-globe/id333180321?mt=8" Scottyg-1
says, "And overall, our bank balance goes up about $1K per year." Scottyg-1
says, "Used to be higher but we kept creating new discounts until there
isn't much left on the bottom line." PhilipC says, "Let's continue the
discussion of the treasury at the next meeting" Lunadyne says, "No new
discounts!" PhilipC says, "The web committee still has to hammer out the
details on the website's design" PhilipC says, "ideally we'll try to come
to this body with 2 or 3 preferences, and then let it make the final
decision" PhilipC says, "personally i'm leaning more towards a sleek
futurist/modernist style. any art work imho should feature
on-the-ground-level surface images of the moon" Rose/Miros says, "that's
what's in the mockup" PhilipC says, "not really. it's still at an orbital
height" Lunadyne says, "I don't want any obviously Apollo stuff."
Strangelv-2 says, "That could be changed with a differett surface pdhoto"
Strangelv-2 says, "This was the only one I could find so far that's high
enough in resoulton without some piece of Apollo era hardware blocking the
view" PhilipC says, "if mountains or ridges aren't breaking the skyline,
then it's not surface level in my opinion" Strangelv-2 says, "I need help
finding source photos" PhilipC says, "there's a lot of apollo era stuff
that doesn't have hardware, or if it does it can be photoshopped out"
Strangelv-2 says, "I also want a color photo" PhilipC says, "the main
reason i think surface-level images are far more powerful is because it
conveys the point that "imagine YOU are there..." imagine what you could
build on that empty field?" dcarson says, "Apollo landings went for nice
flat areas for safety" PhilipC says, "only 11-14. I can't remember if 15
did or not. but i know 16 and 17 were in more geologically diverse terrain"
Strangelv-2 says, "Did any non-manned probes send back anything in color?"
pjbanyai says, "Could the problem with Paypal be due to the fact that we
are not 501(c)3's subtitle 509(a)1 or 509(a)2 otherwise known officially as
a "Public Charity."" bnault says, "Kaguya has nice color photos and videos
from which stills could be taken" pjbanyai says, "Application for 509(a)1
or 509(a)2 requires a detailed audit of where donations came from." bnault
says, "google image "kaguya" and you'll see" Lunadyne says, "That shouldn't
be hard - membership dues. One bequest." Lunadyne says, "I've always liked
this image from OpenLuna:
http://www.openluna.org/resources/You%20On%20The%20Moon%20Postcard.pdf"
Lunadyne says, "Honestly Paul, it's been a long time since I reviewed the
Paypal problem. I'm going to have to dig back through e-mails." Strangelv-2
says, "Also, need featurable links to send people to. The examples no the
mockup are for an interview we filmed at ISDC 2007 and for Lunarpedia. Both
need to be redone, and both are too tall." Scottyg-1 says, "Paul, we ARE a
public charity. I'd have to dig back through the records to get which
section." Lunadyne says, "Hey! That was my ISDC!" Lunadyne says, "Boy that
was a long time ago. I've got interviews at Moonandback that are much more
recent." dcarson says, "I was never able to get anything but an automated
response that we hadn't sub,itted enough documentation and a a list of what
to submit" Strangelv-2 says, "Send me the URLs." dcarson says, "I have
submitted everything on the list" PhilipC says, "If you look at this image"
PhilipC says, "
http://wanderingspace.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/kaguyaapollo.jpg"
PhilipC says, "You'll have a good idea of what sort of picture i'm looking
for wrt the moon" PhilipC says, "It's a picture that says you're NOT on
Earth looking at the moon from a distance, but you're there IN PERSON.
that's far more compelling" Strangelv-2 says, "Does Celestia suppo,rt
surface images? What was that image generated using?" Lunadyne says,
"James, on their way." dcarson says, "
http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a16/a16pan1691942.jpg" dcarson says, "from
http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/journal.corrections.html" dcarson says, "
http://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a16/images16.html#17386-407" Strangelv-2 is
unable to retrieve the video at
http://moonandback.com/2011/06/16/moonandback-interview-with-ken-murphy-part-1-outreach-for-space-awareness/
Lunadyne says, "IIRC, we also have the right to use images from the NSS
Calendar contest: http://www.nss.org/settlement/calendar/gallery.htm"
dcarson says, "Apollo 16 Image Library" Rose/Miros says, "we'll have to
linke to nss" PhilipC says, "If everyone agrees with the idea of preferring
to use lunar images that primarily focus on the surface, by all means
please be on the lookout for them, and send them to the web committee"
Lunadyne says, "
http://moonandback.com/2011/06/17/moonandback-interview-with-ken-murphy-part-2-cislunar-space-and-the-business-case/"
PhilipC says, "But for now, let's not take up valuable time here. " PhilipC
says, "Is there anything else on the agenda?" Lunadyne says, "I would like
to discuss Lava Tubes a bit." Scottyg-1 says, "Philip - One question..."
Lunadyne says, "Also Yuri's Night." Lunadyne says, "Question Scotty?"
PhilipC says, "The web committee doesn't have anything to report other than
we are still in the design process, and that we moved forward with the web
host. " PhilipC says, "Scotty?" pjbanyai says, "say 509(a) subsections
require routine resubmissions to maintain. The default for non-profit
charities is basic 501(c)3. Every charity is deemed to be a private
foundation charity unless it satisfies certain specific IRS requirements.
There is a complex formula which determines which sub-category you may be
valid for." Scottyg-1 says, "Who would make a decision as to who should
have full admin access to our new server?" Lunadyne says, "My vote would be
for the Leadership Team." PhilipC says, "Might I suggest that full admin
authority go to the webmaster and the president?" Scottyg-1 says, "Paul, we
were required to provide 4 years of financial data to establish that we are
a public charity. That was done by filing 990's for our first four years."
PhilipC says, "the president would serve as a backup to give admin
authority to another webmaster if needed, but otherwise the webmaster
should be the admin." bnault says, "from past experience, I would also
suggest that a 3rd person also hold the password (even if they never intend
to use it)" Scottyg-1 says, "I have a letter in our files notifying us that
we met the requirements." PhilipC says, "then perhaps the webmaster
(primary) and president + chair (as backups)" Strangelv-2 wonders what ihem
we are on right now PhilipC says, "James, I'm answering what is in effect a
point of order" Strangelv-2 says, "Seeking clarification more than tyring
ot interrupt" Lunadyne says, "James, we're still on website." Scottyg-1
says, "At the moment, all Web Team members have full access. But we need a
policy decision going forward." Lunadyne says, "I'm okay with the
Leadership Team having access as it provides for a more robust web presence
and ability to deal with surprises." Lunadyne says, "There are questions of
someone 'breaking' the interface (probably me), but I have faith that no
one on the Leadership Team would go on a destructive rampage." bnault says,
"that's what backups are for" Lunadyne says, "But if we all have access
then we're all backups." PhilipC says, "While I respect the desire for
openness, the truth is only a few of us here have the technical skills to
work on the website" bnault says, "I mean backups of the site itself"
Scottyg-1 says, "Mostly, I think there should be a need to know. Handing it
out to too many people increases security risks." Lunadyne says, "Philip, I
agree, and I'm not one of them. I'm happy to let Paul deal with the techie
stuff..." AlanSteinberg says, "I don't have the skills nor do I need to
know, feel free not to tell it to me" Scottyg-1 says, "And need to know
doesn't have to be very strict." Lunadyne says, "How about at least the
Management Team?" PhilipC says, "At the most, I'd probably say we should
limit access to the web team. Better still would be to have a small number
of people that will be accountable" bnault says, "agreed, not everyone
should have it - just enough to make sure we don't lose access by someone
being incapacitated, disgruntled, etc." Rose/Miros says, "ahving to get up
constantly to fix the hubby's blankies" Lunadyne says, "Agree that the Web
Team should have full access at Team Leader's discretion." PhilipC says,
"Right, in addition to the web team, it would probably also make sense for
the president and chairman to have access, for permission granting/revoking
purposes" Lunadyne says, "Secretary for updates." bnault says, "I agree
with Philip" Rose/Miros says, "one thing, if people are available while
we're working on the mockups and/or themes, we don't mind comments"
Scottyg-1 says, "Officers and web team I would think." Scottyg-1 says,
"Others on a case-by-case basis." PhilipC says, "I'm probably an exception
to my rule given that I'm also the web (transition) committee chair.
however once the transition is done, I see my role coming to an end"
PhilipC says, "i'd be perfectly happy remaining on as an admin solely for
permission granting/revoking purposes" PhilipC says, "But we really need to
wrap up this discussion on the web site. This is something we can resolve
via email." Rose/Miros says, "periodically, we can send out a link to a
mockup we find particularly nice" Scottyg-1 says, "So are we agreed on web
team and officers?" Rose/Miros says, "which will become screenshots soon,
hopefully" bnault says, "one last item" bnault says, "we should make sure
ALL passwords are given to the holders (hosting account, server, CMS, etc)"
PhilipC says, "Scotty, no. I'd suggest web team (who actually do admin
stuff) and the president + chair (primarily for permission admin backup)"
Scottyg-1 says, "Ok, with overlap that's exactly who has access now."
Scottyg-1 says, "So I don't have to fix anything. Thanks." Strangelv-2
attempts to discreetly mention that he's rapidly falling asleep PhilipC
says, "Again, we're spending too much time discussing the website. Let's
carry on any further discussion in email. " PhilipC says, "If there are no
objections, let's move on." PhilipC says, "Ken, you have something you want
to say regarding LLT?" Lunadyne says, "Yeah, just an update." Lunadyne
says, "Nothing new from Dave at this point. I'm hoping we have some luck at
the LPSC." Lunadyne says, "I am getting excited about doing a Kickstarter
to run a field exercise." Lunadyne says, "The whole Kickstarter thing is
starting to get a bit long in the tooth, so we have to come up with a
stunning campaign." dcarson says, "need to think of good stuff for various
levels of support and interesting stretch goals" Lunadyne says, "I'd like
folks to start thinking about a Kickstarter campaign. Visit Kickstarter,
Indiegogo and Rockethub and look at some of the existing campaigns. Look at
the Golden Spike campaign to see how not to do it." Strangelv-2 says, "I've
seen some done well and I'wve seen one that was almost a complete disaster.
Beware that once something gets posted as a lewvel it can't be altered."
Strangelv-2 says, "This can be an issue if people looking at the levels
can't make sense of them" Lunadyne says, "We want to come up with as many
intangible rewards as possible. Copies of the paper, video of the field
exercise, etc." Strangelv-2 says, "Probably the best example would be Order
of the Stick" Strangelv-2 says, "Also stretch goals" Strangelv-2 says, "The
stated amount needs to be minimal and reachable. The stretch goals should
be able to reach for the stratosphere, just idon't mention them all at
once" Strangelv-2 says, "There should be builiding excitement as new things
get announced, new graphics, et c." Lunadyne says, "Part of the process is
going to be to put together a budget for the field exercise, which will be
posted in summary form in the camapign itself so that people can see what
the money is going for." Lunadyne says, "Updates could include selection of
a Team Lead, selection of a site, partnering with a robotics team, etc."
bnault says, "factoid: find the April 2013 Sky & Telescope: cover article
on caves and lava tubes" dcarson says, "from the curret Schlock
kickstarter" Lunadyne says, "I contacted the author, who wanted an
honorarium (& travel expense) to talk at ISDC. He may be willing to be
involved with the campaign, though." dcarson says, "tiny percentage -- if
Google Analytics is to believed, roughly 150,000 people read Schlock
Mercenary each month. With fewer than 1,500 backers, the project represents
less than 1% of that crowd. " dcarson says, "The numbers look like this:
10% comes off the top (5% for Amazon Payments, 2.5% for credit-card
processing fees, and 2.5% average dropped charge rate), roughly 20% of the
total will go into postage, and 50% will go into inventory, most of which
will be put towards filling orders." Lunadyne says, "One reward might be a
year's membership in TMS." bnault says, "guys, I have an early flight
tomorrow and I really need to run, lots to do still." dcarson says, "have a
good flight" bnault says, "G'night!" Lunadyne says, "Thanks Ben, have a
safe flight!" Strangelv-2 waves. PhilipC says, "Are there any other
decisions that need to be made that require Ben's vote?" bnault says, "see
you all next time" bnault has disconnected. Lunadyne says, "Moot point..."
Strangelv-2 says, "There's somethitng about a SSP petition, but I can't
remember it clearly" Strangelv-2 says, "It's being put together and might
be something we'd want to join in on given our historical interest"
Lunadyne says, "Back to Kickstarter. Dana's numbers are about right for a
campaign that is tangible reward heavy." Lunadyne says, "Which is why we go
with as much free stuff in the rewards as possible, like memberships."
Lunadyne says, "James, we have to be careful about signing on to other
folks' projects. We don't want to end up in an association that falls on
its face and makes us look bad." Strangelv-2 says, "Understood completely.
I suppose I'm mostly giving a heads up that something might happen"
Lunadyne says, "We can voice support freely, but I don't want TMS to become
the means by which comeone else gets their project done." Strangelv-2 says,
"We'd need it in black and white before we could vote on it" Lunadyne says,
"Okay, we seem to be running out of steam on Lava Tubes, but I do want
folks mulling this over. I anticipate we'll begin putting it together after
ISDC based on what happens there." dcarson says, "but the 1% response is
for a campaign that hit it's first stretch goal in minutes" The housekeeper
arrives to cart bnault off to bed. Strangelv-2 says, "We don't have teh
number of eyeballs as Tayler or Burlew, though" dcarson says, "our
supporters are a lot smaller" Lunadyne says, "This is the kind of project
that will attract attention." dcarson says, "so we need to get a lot more
the the usual crowd to see the campaign" Strangelv-2 says, "Press release,
contacts who are already in the loop" Lunadyne says, "It's got neat
science, we'll get a young science team, and it's a timely topic." Lunadyne
says, "Social media will need to be tapped as well." Strangelv-2 says,
"Which reminds me: did Amara D. Angelica ever get ahold of you?" Lunadyne
says, "Just as an FYI for everyone, I was on the team that put together the
successful NSS campaign from scratch." Lunadyne says, "Who?" Strangelv-2
says, "She's a reporter and someone who runs a SSP website who was
interested in our beaming power demo" Lunadyne says, "I did want to touch
on Yuri's Night, coming up on Friday, April 12th." Lunadyne says, "Oh, and
our Lunar Laboratory Chem Lab" Lunadyne says, "So, Yuri's Night...the world
space party. Does anyone have plans?" Lunadyne says, "Here in D/FW we're
going to have an event at the UTA Planetarium with Anousheh Ansari."
Strangelv-2 says, "wow" Lunadyne says, "This is something we do want to
associate ourselves with, as it appeals to a much younger audience."
Strangelv-2 nods. AlanSteinberg says, "I'll be in Chicago for a conference
that weekend so hopefully I'll be able to attend whatever event is
happening there" Lunadyne says, "I'm going to do an article for the April
MMM." Lunadyne says, "And of course start doing updates on the Facebook
page." Lunadyne says, "I encourage everyone to look to see if there is a
local event and then help make that event a success." Lunadyne says,
"Lastly, the Lunar Laboratory Chem Lab." Lunadyne says, "This is an idea
that came up as a result of an e-mail chain amongst some of the leaders."
Lunadyne says, "It was suggested that Sodium Silicate be used as a binding
agent for Mooncrete." Lunadyne says, "I then asked - is this something that
could be made into a lab experiment for teachers or Science Fair
participants?" Lunadyne says, "So I'm working out a procedure for making
Sodium Silicate and mixing that with Lunar Regolith Simulant to make a form
of Mooncrete." Lunadyne says, "If we can work up several of these we can
offer them up on the Kindle." Lunadyne says, "They don't have to be
strictly Chem Labs. It could be a real-world orbital mechanics problem, or
some other STEM field." Lunadyne says, "Figure about 3-4 pages of write-up
with a nice cover page. All "Moon Society" branded." dcarson says, "Peter's
work with Sodium Silicate and powdered minerals for art, reverse paintings
on glass sheets might be worth doing also" Lunadyne says, "Thoughts?"
dcarson says, "something for the art side" Lunadyne says, "Or an appendix
to the lab?" Lunadyne says, "Or its own separate project?" dcarson says,
"sounds like a good idea, need to get someone who knows how to do a lesson
plan, maybe read ones that are online to compare" AlanSteinberg says,
"sounds good to me" dcarson says, "as a seperate lab I'd think" Lunadyne
says, "I'd like to come up with ideas for about half-a-dozen to start."
Strangelv-2 says, "Could this be tied to the partialyl implemented
university idea?" Lunadyne says, "A chance to move beyond the usual crater
making." Strangelv-2 at the moment can't remember its name Lunadyne says,
"Which partially-implemented university idea? Scholarships for papers? "
Strangelv-2 says, "The one that giwes out awards at ISDC" Lunadyne says,
"Kepler University?" Strangelv-2 says, "No, it's us" Lunadyne says, "Oh,
University of Luna?" Strangelv-2 says, "That sounds right" Lunadyne says,
"I'd rather brand it "The Moon Society"" Strangelv-2 says, "Just tossing
the idea onto the table" Lunadyne says, "Although it could be a University
of Luna project. I really see it more at high school level." Lunadyne says,
"You know, I may drop Paul Spudis a line and pick his brain." Strangelv-2
is out of things to pull out of long term memory that he can finh Lunadyne
says, "He'd probably have LPI do some and steal our thunder..." dcarson
says, "http://baen.com/ya_guides/Teacher_Guides_Catalog_for_Web_PDF.pdf"
Strangelv-2 says, "Ask him about it after the concrete one is already
tested and deployed?" Strangelv-2 says, "Do we have anything at this point
that could get to a motion this evening?" Strangelv-2 says, "And do we have
any other items to discuss?" Lunadyne says, "Nope, it's 10pm, any motions
to adjourn?" Strangelv-2 is unable to so move PhilipC says, "Dana?"
Scottyg-1 says, "I move that we adjourn." Lunadyne says, "World Space Week
did something similar to that Baen teachers guide a while back." Lunadyne
says, "Second." Lunadyne says, "In favor?" dcarson says, "second" PhilipC
says, "So moved. We are now adjourned." Lunadyne says, "aye" dcarson says,
"aye" Scottyg-1 says, "Aye" 
-- End log: Wednesday, March 6, 2013 11:02:34 pm ASI Meeting Server time --